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Seriously though, i'm invariably shocked when i hear all the parts they actually competed with each other in those years to get. Oh and by the way, Judy always coveted the role of MAME either on stage or on screen and i'm not klidding here. I was shocked to read that in the book also.

 

It was Jerry Herman's dream to have Judy replace Angela on stage as Mame. The producers would not go for it because they would never know if Judy would show up or not. Elaine Stritch suggested that she and Judy would do it together and switch off between Mame and Vera. Whoever had been drinking less could would be Mame that night.

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It was Jerry Herman's dream to have Judy replace Angela on stage as Mame. The producers would not go for it because they would never know if Judy would show up or not. Elaine Stritch suggested that she and Judy would do it together and switch off between Mame and Vera. Whoever had been drinking less could would be Mame that night.

NOW THAT'S F U N N Y ! I can totally see Elaine as Vera. Or the banker . . . or the schoolteacher . . . or the naked woman at the piano . . .

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There's a thread going on now on Broadway World who should revive Mame. A lot of Cher being tossed about.

Rosalind Russell was quoted as having said that Cher should have done Mame.

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There's a thread going on now on Broadway World who should revive Mame. A lot of Cher being tossed about.

 

The same people who bitch about Lucy being too old for the part want someone three years older than Lucy was at the time to play Mame? LOL

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The same people who bitch about Lucy being too old for the part want someone three years older than Lucy was at the time to play Mame? LOL

Maybe her DOCTOR can do some work on her before, i think he has SPERIENCE in that area.

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I totally agree about Irene Ryan. Talk about perfect casting as Granny! She created an iconic figure, and nobody will ever be able to play it before. As for Shirley, I've really only seen her in Come Back, Little Sheba, and she gave a shattering performance. Totally real and genuine, as you said. Hazel was one of the shows I grew up watching. I even remember when it went from black and white to color, and Hazel suddenly had a new family--but with the same kid (or am I imagining this?)! After Hazel, she did very little. Probably didn't have to. She did come back in a short-lived sitcome where she played an elderly lady named Grace. That was in early 73, I believe. And, of course, her distinctive voice was used to good effect in one of those Rankin/Bass Christmas shows.

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Damned Hollywood and their concentration on LOOKS and IMAGE instead of acting ability, Irene Ryan NEVER got the recognition she so richly deserved and at my house, we never missed Shirley's show. We loved her on tv but hated her in those boring movies where she played down and out losers. You see, her acceptance speech at the Emmys shows she was as beautiful INSIDE and so so genuine in everything she did.

The Emmys were so cheap ass in the mid 60s, cutting down the awards to just a handful each year, so many deserving people did not get their due as a result like the great, great Irene Ryan. Nowadays though it's ridiculous how many Emmy categories there are, like best actor 20-25 with two lines on a soap opera, best song hummed on a sitcom, whatever.

 

I loved Shirley Booth's movies though, very dramatic and moving performances and one of the most deserved Oscar winners ever. She was sensational in everything she did. I just discovered many of her 40's radio dramas this year online and she was equally great in those (of course during that period she was a well-known Broadway actress already). She really does seem to have been a "Hazel" in real-life, a warm, loving good-humored woman.

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Cher would be horrible as Mame--with that deep voice and skewered punctuations! I can hear her now: "open a new windowwww-owwww! Opennn a new doahhhhhh!" Bette Midler would be perfect casting. She's got just the right theatrical verve and knows how to sing beautifully. She was great in the TV version of Gypsy!

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I totally agree about Irene Ryan. Talk about perfect casting as Granny! She created an iconic figure, and nobody will ever be able to play it before. As for Shirley, I've really only seen her in Come Back, Little Sheba, and she gave a shattering performance. Totally real and genuine, as you said. Hazel was one of the shows I grew up watching. I even remember when it went from black and white to color, and Hazel suddenly had a new family--but with the same kid (or am I imagining this?)! After Hazel, she did very little. Probably didn't have to. She did come back in a short-lived sitcome where she played an elderly lady named Grace. That was in early 73, I believe. And, of course, her distinctive voice was used to good effect in one of those Rankin/Bass Christmas shows.

Oh i LOVED that new sitcom GRACE or whatever it was called, but then, this woman was so great, she's another like Lucy who could just sit there and read the phone book . . .

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The Emmys were so cheap ass in the mid 60s, cutting down the awards to just a handful each year, so many deserving people did not get their due as a result like the great, great Irene Ryan. Nowadays though it's ridiculous how many Emmy categories there are, like best actor 20-25 with two lines on a soap opera, best song hummed on a sitcom, whatever.

 

I loved Shirley Booth's movies though, very dramatic and moving performances and one of the most deserved Oscar winners ever. She was sensational in everything she did. I just discovered many of her 40's radio dramas this year online and she was equally great in those (of course during that period she was a well-known Broadway actress already). She really does seem to have been a "Hazel" in real-life, a warm, loving good-humored woman.

I know, i was only putting down her movies as all movies have to be boring to win. She was the BEST thing about Come Back Little Sheba, i think i even have it recorded when it played on TCM. The Emmys had that CLASS thing, Hope Lange, give her two in a row, she's classy, in a show nobody remembers, but beautiful blonde. Irene Ryan was excellent but didn't do teh class thing playing a woman missing teeth ina charwoman's wardrobe, hitting the jug, but if you think about it, her role was a female Fred, ornery and a real pain in the ass, always had to have her way like Lucy, but played a role nobody but nobody could ever duplicate. Not even the great Cloris Leachman in that horrid movie version of the show.
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Cher would be horrible as Mame--with that deep voice and skewered punctuations! I can hear her now: "open a new windowwww-owwww! Opennn a new doahhhhhh!" Bette Midler would be perfect casting. She's got just the right theatrical verve and knows how to sing beautifully. She was great in the TV version of Gypsy!

Can't argue with that. But i'm sure Cher would make changes in her singing style to accomodate the material. Hey, by the way, in teh Shirley Hemphill conversation, did you mean Lucy kept saying YOU FOOL! Or Shirley? I've heard Lucy say it one time so i just wondered, i thought you meant Lucy.

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Can't argue with that. But i'm sure Cher would make changes in her singing style to accomodate the material. Hey, by the way, in teh Shirley Hemphill conversation, did you mean Lucy kept saying YOU FOOL! Or Shirley? I've heard Lucy say it one time so i just wondered, i thought you meant Lucy.

 

Haha! No, Shirley's the one who kept saying "you fool" on What's Happening and What's Happening, Now! It was her trademarked saying, like JJ's "dynomite!" Except it didn't catch on, and then Shirley would just glare at whoever she was talking to. She was a scary lady!

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Haha! No, Shirley's the one who kept saying "you fool" on What's Happening and What's Happening, Now! It was her trademarked saying, like JJ's "dynomite!" Except it didn't catch on, and then Shirley would just glare at whoever she was talking to. She was a scary lady!

Sorry, then, i let you have it because i thought you were talking about Lucy, just protecting my little luv, sorry again. I never ever watched that shit sitcom.

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There's a thread going on now on Broadway World who should revive Mame. A lot of Cher being tossed about.

 

Tossed about and I hope OUT! But I guess by default, why not? I mean, who else?

I honestly can't think of anyone who would thrill as Mame these days. Christine Baranski did a tour. don't know that she was hopeful that it would eventually land on Broadway or not.

 

Speaking of Judy doing Mame. Some people say by this time she was just not up to it. Could be, but she did do another Palace run in 1967, about the time she was considered as a Mame replacement and I haven't heard that she was unreliable there. However her Palace show might not have been as taxing as Mame.

At the very least, I don't know why Judy never did an album of Mame songs or incorporate "If He Walked..." into her act. Seems a natural song selection for her.

Something from the Robert Wagner autobiography I just read. Warners bought the Gypsy property for Natalie and evidently Rose had not been cast. The Wagners said there was only one person to play her: Judy. I'm fine with Roz, but only fine. Less so with the movie. Would have preferred Merman. But Judy as Rose would have been sensational. She was still riding the wave of successes at the time and I think she could have pulled it off. She had done her "Nuremburg" cameo and received an oscar nomination and then done two movies in succession. With the background of her experience with her own mother, she could have brought a lot to the role---not to mention that voice singing those songs.

The Wagners story goes counter to what I've read in the past. Gypsy/Natalie is not the central figure though by the previews and posters you'd think she was. Rose is the plum role and the story goes that Roz's husband bought it for her...and Merman was livid because she had been promised the movie by Warners.

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Sorry, then, i let you have it because i thought you were talking about Lucy, just protecting my little luv, sorry again. I never ever watched that shit sitcom.

 

Haha! I don't blame you. Both shows were awful.

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Tossed about and I hope OUT! But I guess by default, why not? I mean, who else?

I honestly can't think of anyone who would thrill as Mame these days. Christine Baranski did a tour. don't know that she was hopeful that it would eventually land on Broadway or not.

 

Speaking of Judy doing Mame. Some people say by this time she was just not up to it. Could be, but she did do another Palace run in 1967, about the time she was considered as a Mame replacement and I haven't heard that she was unreliable there. However her Palace show might not have been as taxing as Mame.

At the very least, I don't know why Judy never did an album of Mame songs or incorporate "If He Walked..." into her act. Seems a natural song selection for her.

Something from the Robert Wagner autobiography I just read. Warners bought the Gypsy property for Natalie and evidently Rose had not been cast. The Wagners said there was only one person to play her: Judy. I'm fine with Roz, but only fine. Less so with the movie. Would have preferred Merman. But Judy as Rose would have been sensational. She was still riding the wave of successes at the time and I think she could have pulled it off. She had done her "Nuremburg" cameo and received an oscar nomination and then done two movies in succession. With the background of her experience with her own mother, she could have brought a lot to the role---not to mention that voice singing those songs.

The Wagners story goes counter to what I've read in the past. Gypsy/Natalie is not the central figure though by the previews and posters you'd think she was. Rose is the plum role and the story goes that Roz's husband bought it for her...and Merman was livid because she had been promised the movie by Warners.

Again, you are spot on on everything you said. Well, Baranski's great but not as Mame, not BIG enough i fear. Judy missed loads of shows at that time due to her problems, i remember even Merv talking about it on his show, WILL SHE SHOW UP, WILL SHE BE OK, CAN SHE STILL BELT THEM OUT . . . But it's different for a film, they have more time to do each number perfectly, Jusy woulda been wunnerful wunnerful, yes, man, who else could do IF HE WALKED INTO MY LIFE so memorably?

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Tossed about and I hope OUT! But I guess by default, why not? I mean, who else?

I honestly can't think of anyone who would thrill as Mame these days. Christine Baranski did a tour. don't know that she was hopeful that it would eventually land on Broadway or not.

 

Speaking of Judy doing Mame. Some people say by this time she was just not up to it. Could be, but she did do another Palace run in 1967, about the time she was considered as a Mame replacement and I haven't heard that she was unreliable there. However her Palace show might not have been as taxing as Mame.

At the very least, I don't know why Judy never did an album of Mame songs or incorporate "If He Walked..." into her act. Seems a natural song selection for her.

Something from the Robert Wagner autobiography I just read. Warners bought the Gypsy property for Natalie and evidently Rose had not been cast. The Wagners said there was only one person to play her: Judy. I'm fine with Roz, but only fine. Less so with the movie. Would have preferred Merman. But Judy as Rose would have been sensational. She was still riding the wave of successes at the time and I think she could have pulled it off. She had done her "Nuremburg" cameo and received an oscar nomination and then done two movies in succession. With the background of her experience with her own mother, she could have brought a lot to the role---not to mention that voice singing those songs.

The Wagners story goes counter to what I've read in the past. Gypsy/Natalie is not the central figure though by the previews and posters you'd think she was. Rose is the plum role and the story goes that Roz's husband bought it for her...and Merman was livid because she had been promised the movie by Warners.

 

Christine Baranski's revival of Mame at the Kennedy Center was rumored to move to Broadway's Palace Theatre for a brief run in between bookings, but it was nixed for being too expensive.

 

Judy's stint at the Palace only ran a few weeks. I'm sure the producers were hesitant about casting her as the lead in a book musical that she would have to perform eight shows a week. This came right after her firing from Valley of the Dolls. I found a recording of Judy attempting to do "If He Walked into My Life" in concert and just giving up. I can't find any other reference to if she actually incorporated it into her concerts. It does seem a natural fit for her. http://www.tumblr.co...ed-into-my-life

 

I've always heard the story that Freddie Brisson bought Gypsy for wife Roz Russell. Of course, there are the crazy people who claim that Lucy owned the film rights to Mame. I know at one point there was plans for them to do Gypsy without any of the music!

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Got my hands on Ahnud's new book, that's Mr Schwarznegger sp? and he has nothing but great things to say about our lovable redhead. He talks about their working together on Happy Anniversary and Goodbye, said it was great exposure which got him other acting jobs right away. He loved working with her and said she gave him advice about his career and was a great guiding hand. He says they stayed friends afterwards and saw each other often at various events like the Carousel Ball. I have new respect for the man, have seen all his movies but lost respect for him after that maid incident and the divorce from Maria Shriver. BUT, anybody who loves Lucy is ok by me.

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Maria Shriver, not Kennedy. LOL

Sorry, it was late, i was tired, couldn't remember what else he said about Lucy. He had this whole page or more on auditioning for the job. They had asked him to come in and read which he did not know how to do a reading, so he just read it and they did not like his delivery so Lucy established this whole improvising thing where she helped him along. BUT, come taping night, he had no idea how it would be in front of a live audience. He got applause and laughs and again Lucy had to save him as he had no SPERIENCE, but she liked him and saw how much he wanted to succeed so she helped him with everything and they then started a friendship that never faltered. There's another perfect example of how Lucy was nurturing to people just starting out.

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