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yendor1152

Lucy and Mame? Oil and water!

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How I wish Lotus would contribute more to this thread. At least his opinions, although a lot of us disagree with them, are well founded and not...well, completely obnoxious. lol

Yeah i'm looking at Lotus a whole different way now that i've heard this moron from hell.
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How I wish Lotus would contribute more to this thread. At least his opinions, although a lot of us disagree with them, are well founded and not...well, completely obnoxious. lol

 

Exactly. At least Lotus was more respectful in his criticisms. Oh I'm sorry....Brian. I don't want to be so insular I can't type out his real name. LMAO

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Exactly. At least Lotus was more respectful in his criticisms. Oh I'm sorry....Brian. I don't want to be so insular I can't type out his real name. LMAO

I wonder which is his I Q 11 or 52.

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As Fred Mertz said on more than one occasion, "HOLY COW!" :bill1:

 

And, as Lucy Carmichael once said, "Children now please!" :lucy2:

 

Now, everyone. Take a deep breath. Is all of this really worth getting worked up over?

 

It's a movie. A long strip of celluloid that was captured nearly 40 years ago. Is a piece of film designed for the sole purpose of diverting one's attention for 2 hours worth all this vitriol?

 

No, I will never feel that this movie is a crowning achievement for anyone involved, I've stated that many times. And I think yendor had every right to start a thread on it. Obviously this is a topic he feels very passionatly on, and I think it's good to focus on Lucy's more divisive projects. But can all of us just take a step back and let people say their piece without all this pouncing? I'm not pointing out anyone in particular, and I'm including myself in this as well. So some of us like it and some of us don't. Let's all be adults here and not get overemotional.

 

After all, it's just a movie that everyone went into with good intentions and even if the final result failed to please many people (myself included) it was certainly an attempt. Nobody sets out to make a bad movie, and even I've been in a position where I thought I was doing something wonderful only to get kicked in the ass by reality in the end. It happens. We all have our follies; some work, some don't. Just because I don't love Lucy in Mame doesn't mean I don't love her in nearly everything else she did. I don't hold it against her. So voice your views all you want, nothing wrong with that, but let's not hold it against anyone for disagreeing with us. I don't want to see this board deteriorate.

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As Fred Mertz said on more than one occasion, "HOLY COW!" :bill1:

 

And, as Lucy Carmichael once said, "Children now please!" :lucy2:

 

Now, everyone. Take a deep breath. Is all of this really worth getting worked up over?

 

It's a movie. A long strip of celluloid that was captured nearly 40 years ago. Is a piece of film designed for the sole purpose of diverting one's attention for 2 hours worth all this vitriol?

 

No, I will never feel that this movie is a crowning achievement for anyone involved, I've stated that many times. And I think yendor had every right to start a thread on it. Obviously this is a topic he feels very passionatly on, and I think it's good to focus on Lucy's more divisive projects. But can all of us just take a step back and let people say their piece without all this pouncing? I'm not pointing out anyone in particular, and I'm including myself in this as well. So some of us like it and some of us don't. Let's all be adults here and not get overemotional.

 

After all, it's just a movie that everyone went into with good intentions and even if the final result failed to please many people (myself included) it was certainly an attempt. Nobody sets out to make a bad movie, and even I've been in a position where I thought I was doing something wonderful only to get kicked in the ass by reality in the end. It happens. We all have our follies; some work, some don't. Just because I don't love Lucy in Mame doesn't mean I don't love her in nearly everything else she did. I don't hold it against her. So voice your views all you want, nothing wrong with that, but let's not hold it against anyone for disagreeing with us. I don't want to see this board deteriorate.

But Lotus, he`s saying things just to push people`s buttons and this is a Lucy Lounge, where we pay tribute to her, not to attack her with nonsensical platitudes.

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And thank you to those who wanted me to contribute more, I appreciate that.

Yeah, imagine us having to turn to YOU, of all people, LOL! But i don`t recall you being as mean and nitpicky as this one though.

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But Lotus, he`s saying things just to push people`s buttons and this is a Lucy Lounge, where we pay tribute to her, not to attack her with nonsensical platitudes.

 

Yeah, I think he gets his jollies (or is it 'hawwwlies"?) off of riling people up. Look at some of the other weird and stupid crap he's said in the past to get people pissed off.

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Hey, now this I understand. But let's be real--Lucy put Mame out for the public. She may have had a ball doing it (and from what I've heard, that wasn't the case all the time), and she definitely had outsized expectations of the finished product--but I think it did more harm than good. It essentially ruined her film career, and she did teary-eyed interviews where she defended the film and claimed people were printing horrible pictures of her, when Warner Brothers had beautiful pix to distribute. I'm sure it was a devastating experience, but the reality of the situation was beyond her. She was stuck in another time, and it definitely was NOT the 70s. Film musicals of that period had to have their feet in reality. Mame didn't. It wasn't sleazy like Cabaret, it wasn't "young and fresh" like Willie Wonka and Grease. It just sat there, like a pile of...holly.

I understand this also. Imagine how hurt she was! Her work meant everything to her. But LWL was probably the biggest devastation professionally for her. Musicals had to be really good to not flop in the 70's and Grease and Willy Wonka are two of the greatest movie musicals of all time now. Who hasn't seen em and loved em?!

 

But like I said I love this movie. She looks stunning and really is enjoying what she is doing. She loved her work and couldn't wait for her fans to see it. That's not pushing it out for the public.

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But Lotus, he`s saying things just to push people`s buttons and this is a Lucy Lounge, where we pay tribute to her, not to attack her with nonsensical platitudes.

 

Yes, it does appear that way. I agree with some of his comments but (and with no disrespect towards yendor or anyone intended) some of them I do feel go too far for the sake of going too far. I know I've been in a spot where I want to be as contrarian as possible, and I can't speak for any motives here, but it does sadden me to see things sink so low no matter what the topic. Initially this topic seemed more objective than it became. I've seen some insightful comments here but it sort of became pure snark somewhere along the line. This is obviously a passionate topic for all of us, I wish we could get back to having a more adult conversation about this. Please?

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Yes, it does appear that way. I agree with some of his comments but (and with no disrespect towards yendor or anyone intended) some of them I do feel go too far for the sake of going too far. I know I've been in a spot where I want to be as contrarian as possible, and I can't speak for any motives here, but it does sadden me to see things sink so low no matter what the topic. Initially this topic seemed more objective than it became. I've seen some insightful comments here but it sort of became pure snark somewhere along the line. This is obviously a passionate topic for all of us, I wish we could get back to having a more adult conversation about this. Please?

 

I'm all about going back to being adults here!

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I understand this also. Imagine how hurt she was! Her work meant everything to her. But LWL was probably the biggest devastation professionally for her. Musicals had to be really good to not flop in the 70's and Grease and Willy Wonka are two of the greatest movie musicals of all time now. Who hasn't seen em and loved em?!

 

But like I said I love this movie. She looks stunning and really is enjoying what she is doing. I also love the Mame character. I love all adaptions of it.

People resented that she was in a musical and not a comedy, but if they had put more comedy in it, they would have said she was bringing Lucy Ricardo to the screen, she just could not win. If she had just lip sinched the numbers she would have gotten hell for that too, she does dance numbers with a broken leg and they bitch about the expression on her face, talk about a tough crowd.

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Yes, it does appear that way. I agree with some of his comments but (and with no disrespect towards yendor or anyone intended) some of them I do feel go too far for the sake of going too far. I know I've been in a spot where I want to be as contrarian as possible, and I can't speak for any motives here, but it does sadden me to see things sink so low no matter what the topic. Initially this topic seemed more objective than it became. I've seen some insightful comments here but it sort of became pure snark somewhere along the line. This is obviously a passionate topic for all of us, I wish we could get back to having a more adult conversation about this. Please?

Why, you want us to bore people with nonsense, i think there is nothing wrong with a spirited discussion, i just think he went overboard so we did too.

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People resented that she was in a musical and not a comedy, but if they had put more comedy in it, they would have said she was bringing Lucy Ricardo to the screen, she just could not win. If she had just lip sinched the numbers she would have gotten hell for that too, she does dance numbers with a broken leg and they bitch about the exp<b></b>ression on her face, talk about a tough crowd.

The wanting for typecast at its finest. She completely got shat on for something she worked so hard for and loved dearly. No one really deserves that.

 

And the rude remarks are still coming 39 years later.

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To refer to the opinion of one Bea Arthur, who made no secret in her later years of her regret doing the movie and her opinion that Lucy was miscast... even she had the class to say "but that's neither here nor there. I know there were people who liked it and maybe I'm not being objective enough." So even Bea, though she personally felt Lucy not right for the part, knew that her view wasn't necessarily the way someone else would see it. Bea also made a point of adding that Lucy was "lovely and charming" and a pleasure to work with.

 

I find it very admirable that Lucille wanted to do a project that was very "non-Lucy". All actors should want to tackle new types of roles. And she'd been playing "Lucy" for so long I'm sure she was dying for a break. Did she bite off more than she could chew? Any answer to that will, of course, be subjective, but she tried. And the limited choreography is certainly understandable given that she'd just broken her leg not long before!

 

I'm positive that, had Lucy had George Cukor to direct her, she would've come across much better. Not that she was terrible, mind you. I don't find her quite right for the part but certainly don't find her terrible. Certain scenes of hers are very good. I enjoyed her pensive rendition of "If He Walked Into My Life"...wish I'd remember to say that earlier! As a matter of fact, I find her much more palatable in the later half of the movie when she and the character aligned more in age. She did some good stuff there. But I digress...Cukor was such a gifted director of women, he would've known how to frame and stage shots to better suit her, I bet. And perhaps he could've given her added perspective on the character to make her feel more at ease. Mame would be a demanding enough part for a woman of 40 let alone 60. It's not easy to have that much vim and verve all the time, I'm sure! So I certainly respect her attempt, and it is a shame the initial reviews (although they had their points) were so crass about it.

 

No, I don't think she was ideally cast, but they could've done so much worse. And Mame isn't the worst musical of the 70's by a long shot. Anyone seen any of "Lost Horizon?" And if the hideous cover art for "Song of Norway" is any clue of what the film is like it'll send anyone screaming into the hills. Had the film been done in the 60s it no doubt would've found more favour. As it is, it's one of the few records of this show that there are, as it's not frequently done nowadays and isn't likely to get a Broadway revival anytime soon. So for those curious about the story and who want more than the cast album, then it's certainly something to provide a glimpse as to what this musical was all about.

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As I said, you can have an opinion but no need to have a go at other people or keep repeating the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again! Yendor NEVER contributes to anything +ve in this forum. He berates Lucy whenever he gets the chance!

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To refer to the opinion of one Bea Arthur, who made no secret in her later years of her regret doing the movie and her opinion that Lucy was miscast... even she had the class to say "but that's neither here nor there. I know there were people who liked it and maybe I'm not being objective enough." So even Bea, though she personally felt Lucy not right for the part, knew that her view wasn't necessarily the way someone else would see it. Bea also made a point of adding that Lucy was "lovely and charming" and a pleasure to work with.

 

I find it very admirable that Lucille wanted to do a project that was very "non-Lucy". All actors should want to tackle new types of roles. And she'd been playing "Lucy" for so long I'm sure she was dying for a break. Did she bite off more than she could chew? Any answer to that will, of course, be subjective, but she tried. And the limited choreography is certainly understandable given that she'd just broken her leg not long before!

 

I'm positive that, had Lucy had George Cukor to direct her, she would've come across much better. Not that she was terrible, mind you. I don't find her quite right for the part but certainly don't find her terrible. Certain scenes of hers are very good. I enjoyed her pensive rendition of "If He Walked Into My Life"...wish I'd remember to say that earlier! But I digress...Cukor was such a gifted director of women, he would've known how to frame and stage shots to better suit her, I bet. And perhaps he could've given her added perspective on the character to make her feel more at ease. Mame would be a demanding enough part for a woman of 40 let alone 60. It's not easy to have that much vim and verve all the time, I'm sure! So I certainly respect her attempt, and it is a shame the initial reviews (although they had their points) were so crass about it.

 

No, I don't think she was ideally cast, but they could've done so much worse. And Mame isn't the worst musical of the 70's by a long shot. Anyone seen any of "Lost Horizon?" And if the hideous cover art for "Song of Norway" is any clue of what the film is like it'll send anyone screaming into the hills. Had the film been done in the 60s it no doubt would've found more favour. As it is, it's one of the few records of this show that there are, as it's not frequently done nowadays and isn't likely to get a Broadway revival anytime soon. So for those curious about the story and who want more than the cast album, then it's certainly something to provide a glimpse as to what this musical was all about.

Funny, i was just going to bring up Lost Horizon. And there`s no ifs ands or buts about Cukor, he would have gotten her an Oscar nomination. Instead, he went on to Travels with my aunt with Maggie Smith and got HER an Oscar nom that same year.
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As I said, you can have an opinion but no need to have a go at other people or keep repeating the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again! Yendor NEVER contributes to anything +ve in this forum. He berates Lucy whenever he gets the chance!

Not only that, be he does it over and over and over and over . . .

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. . . and over.

 

LOL! Oh well, good to know I'm already in the running for "Post Of 2013". :lucyhaha: It just worries me knowing there are still 363 days left for someone to outdo me! :lucyeww:

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LOL! Oh well, good to know I'm already in the running for "Post Of 2013". :lucyhaha: It just worries me knowing there are still 363 days left for someone to outdo me! :lucyeww:

Just post a pic of YOU hollin out your holley and that should do it for ya.

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Just wanted to bump this one as it's my peace-offering post :)

 

To refer to the opinion of one Bea Arthur, who made no secret in her later years of her regret doing the movie and her opinion that Lucy was miscast... even she had the class to say "but that's neither here nor there. I know there were people who liked it and maybe I'm not being objective enough." So even Bea, though she personally felt Lucy not right for the part, knew that her view wasn't necessarily the way someone else would see it. Bea also made a point of adding that Lucy was "lovely and charming" and a pleasure to work with.

 

I find it very admirable that Lucille wanted to do a project that was very "non-Lucy". All actors should want to tackle new types of roles. And she'd been playing "Lucy" for so long I'm sure she was dying for a break. Did she bite off more than she could chew? Any answer to that will, of course, be subjective, but she tried. And the limited choreography is certainly understandable given that she'd just broken her leg not long before!

 

I'm positive that, had Lucy had George Cukor to direct her, she would've come across much better. Not that she was terrible, mind you. I don't find her quite right for the part but certainly don't find her terrible. Certain scenes of hers are very good. I enjoyed her pensive rendition of "If He Walked Into My Life"...wish I'd remember to say that earlier! As a matter of fact, I find her much more palatable in the later half of the movie when she and the character aligned more in age. She did some good stuff there. But I digress...Cukor was such a gifted director of women, he would've known how to frame and stage shots to better suit her, I bet. And perhaps he could've given her added perspective on the character to make her feel more at ease. Mame would be a demanding enough part for a woman of 40 let alone 60. It's not easy to have that much vim and verve all the time, I'm sure! So I certainly respect her attempt, and it is a shame the initial reviews (although they had their points) were so crass about it.

 

No, I don't think she was ideally cast, but they could've done so much worse. And Mame isn't the worst musical of the 70's by a long shot. Anyone seen any of "Lost Horizon?" And if the hideous cover art for "Song of Norway" is any clue of what the film is like it'll send anyone screaming into the hills. Had the film been done in the 60s it no doubt would've found more favour. As it is, it's one of the few records of this show that there are, as it's not frequently done nowadays and isn't likely to get a Broadway revival anytime soon. So for those curious about the story and who want more than the cast album, then it's certainly something to provide a glimpse as to what this musical was all about.

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